This is a great discussion folks, keep it going. I do want to add tho', that the ultimate 'product' needs to point towards something that is operationalizable and monetizable. If you stand back and look across Kantara's portfolio, you'll see a kind of cadence: Brainstorming DGs - to - Spec writing WGs - to - conformance assessment Programs. Kantara offers the DGs to make it easy to contribute and investigate, size and frame up value propositions that industry needs. DGs are the 'birds of a feather' that typically draw in first movers and thought leaders like you, in order to frame up WGs that bring in a community of paying members because that community wants that spec/whatever written, to solve a particular problem. And once it is written they typically want to formalize that through paid conformance assessment and approval, to delineate those who have it and those that don't, in the marketplace - for the safety, security and privacy of all users of the digital economy. That is Kantara's business model. Roughly 60% of Kantara's revenue comes from membership, and 40% from the Identity Assurance Program. Kantara wants to reverse that metric and in the long term, drive down the reliance on membership once a sufficient number of monetized programs can carry the overhead costs of the platform. The Identity Assurance Program came about because of a need (in that case US Federal agencies needing to leverage private sector Identity and Credential Service Providers) which in turn brought the CSPs to join Kantara, form the Identity Assurance Working Group and to contribute to the spec (in that case the Identity Assurance Framework) which in turn became the monetized 3rd party assessment and conformance Program, for which Kantara is known globally for. You can see glimmers of this model surfacing in discussions in the Consent & Information Sharing WG about writing conformance criteria for the recently balloted Consent Receipt, and in the Identity of Things DG.... I ask you to spare a thought for this lens through which to view Kantara, as you work through these great suggestions. Whatever you decide, it doesn't have to be a mirror image of the Identity Assurance Program, nor using the synergies of another WG's outputs, tho' both are good beacons to be guided by. But it does have to be a strong enough value proposition that motivates a community to come to Kantara to do their work to solve their problems. And the revenue they bring allows Kantara to continue to cover the cost of great brainstorming DGs like the BSC DG that kick-starts the cadence of the model. Cheers Colin Executive Director Cell: +44 (0)7490 266 778 Kantara Initiative Inc. <https://kantarainitiative.org/> On Fri, Apr 28, 2017 at 4:03 PM, Susan Joseph <susan.joseph1786@gmail.com> wrote:
Thomas and Eve, I agree with (b). If we can contribute to that and provide a guide for some uniformity about enforceability, it would go a long way. I know there is a big group within the legal profession who believe our current laws already cover them. That has not stopped and will not stop legislatures from adopting new laws, so anything that can contribute to not having a patchwork of mismatched standards will help. Susan
On Fri, Apr 28, 2017 at 8:14 AM, Thomas Hardjono <hardjono@mit.edu> wrote:
Eve: We've talked from time to time about the UMA Legal subgroup possibly spinning up as its own group. Maybe there's something to think about here – combining forces, or two separate WGs? Maybe a "Legal WG" with Kantara-wide scope would make sense; John repeats himself in Legal, CIS, a lot. It would need to be able to produce technical specs as well (that is, have the right IPR policy for that).
One thing that I'd like to see is a specification (actual spec, not best practices or guidelines) on a "smart-contract", something that has a hope of being accepted in the legal mindset/industry:
(a) Technical: What is a technical definition of a smart contract: define the fields (syntax), allowable values and allowable interpretations (e.g. semantics). Digital signatures.
(b) Legal: What information needs to be captured in a smart-contract, for example, to make it admissible in court.
Some progress is being made (see bill HB2417 in Arizona and the one in Vermont by Oliver Goodfellow), but I believe more work needs to be done. For example, is the legal acceptance of HB2417 based on the digital signatures only or also on additional features.
So, a new Kantara WG (a) with the right mix of legal/technical and (b) very well defined deliverables, would be groundbreaking.
/thomas/
________________________________________ From: dg-bsc-bounces@kantarainitiative.org [dg-bsc-bounces@kantarainitiat ive.org] on behalf of Colin Wallis [colin@kantarainitiative.org] Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2017 11:11 PM To: Eve Maler Cc: dg-bsc@kantarainitiative.org Subject: Re: [DG-BSC] Notes from BSC telecon Thursday, April 27
Folks
Great work there. Thanks!
The Report is shaping up well, but as Eve implies, it needs your best strategic thought bubbles being applied to those recommendations.
If this helps at all, I am aware that the Leadership Council is seriously considering re-starting Kantara's P3 WG (Privacy and Public Policy). Who was around and remembers those ground-breaking, thought provoking calls on P3?:-).
I bring this to your attention because if you do recommend a Legal WG, combining the efforts from UMA Legal and BSC, then there will be great cross-walk potential with P3.
Thanks again,
Colin
Executive Director Cell: +44 (0)7490 266 778 Kantara Initiative Inc.<https://kantarainitiative.org/>
[https://drive.google.com/uc?id=0B7y8c3lrgRtUUjRFMHFMQm1BR3M &export=download]
On Thu, Apr 27, 2017 at 8:52 PM, Eve Maler <eve.maler@forgerock.com<mailt o:eve.maler@forgerock.com>> wrote: http://kantarainitiative.org/confluence/display/BSC/2017-04+ %28April+2017%29+Meetings#id-2017-04(April2017)Meetings-Thursday,April27
Agenda:
* Report<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1HOVJ3lKqOIjwCqPt 5jFxfLr7wEoJ0ZVNbMGsdsWzCKQ/edit?usp=sharing> work
Attending: Eve, Matisse, Marco, Thomas, Susan, Jeff, Maryann, Kathleen, JohnW
The candidate recommendations are, so far, not captured in the report – . Let's confirm today which ones we "believe in", and add any others, and then put them in the report.
Kathleen notes that ONC is beginning work on a trust framework/contract. Hopefully
Our WG recommendation: How about: Spin up a WG to develop on blockchains and smart contract good practice on use and handling of data related to individuals so as to facilitate individual autonomy [and enable equitable and efficient participation in transaction ecosystems?].
John talks about knowledge, choice, and control as the three axes of autonomy. Ecosystems typically constrain autonomy.
Add to potential liaison relationships: ONC and HL7.
The recommendation we want to make has a pretty sharp audience, set of outputs, set of activities, and set of directions for next steps.
We've talked from time to time about the UMA Legal subgroup possibly spinning up as its own group. Maybe there's something to think about here – combining forces, or two separate WGs? Maybe a "Legal WG" with Kantara-wide scope would make sense; John repeats himself in Legal, CIS, a lot. It would need to be able to produce technical specs as well (that is, have the right IPR policy for that).
Kickstarting the good practice work: We want to recommend to all the "legal capacity to contract" (parties/counterparties) people that they should be using identity standards and, as much as possible, standard claim catalogs so that they can get the benefit of standard flows and standard claim/attribute semantics. (Point to "Analysis of Integrating Legal Contracts and Smart Contracts" section.)
Eve made up an editing task list for herself and Thomas. Keep an eye on report changes.
AI: All: Please review the Report and comment in it or on the list! Keep in mind we're at the very end.
AI: Eve: Ask for one more meeting next Thursday. It's the LAST ONE.
Eve Maler ForgeRock Office of the CTO | VP Innovation & Emerging Technology Cell +1 425.345.6756<tel:(425)%20345-6756> | Skype: xmlgrrl | Twitter: @xmlgrrl
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