Colin, I concur. Too long in letting the dough rise leads to poor baking results in the end (that's all I have for analogy - I'm eating breakfast right now)!

Seriously: Kantara needs the report to gives a good situational analysis of the BSC space and proposes a series of topics that could a) be given a mandate to use a WG to develop Kantara Recommendations or specifications (a.k.a. "Standards") or b) use a DG to investigate the topic further in a 6 month window resulting in a mandate suitable for treatment as a).

Personally I like taxonomies to classify the topic areas but any representation that permits future expansion and refinement is possible.

andrew.

Andrew Hughes CISM CISSP 
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In Turn Information Management Consulting

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On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 7:34 AM, Colin Wallis <colin_wallis@hotmail.com> wrote:

Thanks John M, John W, James, Patrick et al


I think we are all in agreement we could do with more input from the broader BC and SC communities.
And of course that is most welcomed, moreso if they bring their own communities with them and join Kantara which helps pay for the platform on which the DG rests:-).

I'm also sensitive to the LC Chair Andrew's motivation to bring DG discussions to a conclusion at frequent intervals (typically 6 months) in order to get onto the work of addressing the issues that the DG use cases and deliberations raise.  

These two things are not mutually exclusive. We can have a WG working on solutions arising from a DG output, while at the same time having a DG continue to draw in more use cases and discussion. The Charters need to be directed and focussed accordingly and the timelines clear.

John W's estimates are about right. We started this DG in May, so we need to have it concluded November latest. Take off a month of writing and there is 2 months left.

It is really tempting to slip the timeline to allow more discussion in a DG, as a preface to WG work. 
But past experience has shown us that that often comes at the expense of focussing the resulting WG on nailing the solutions to the problems raised, to a logical formal end deliverable in a community-valuable timeframe.
There is so much to do in this space. 
Biting it off in a continual process of digestible chunks is absolutely OK.

Cheers
Colin

  

From: John Moehrke <johnmoehrke@gmail.com>
Sent: 29 August 2016 13:42
To: James Hazard
Cc: Colin Wallis; dg-bsc@kantarainitiative.org
Subject: Re: [DG-BSC] FYI
 
I have a potential new use of Blockchain and Smart-Contracts. I have written it up using the template, but don't yet have rights on the Kantara system. I have published what I have developed with a friend of mine (Health Informaticist and Researcher) onto my Blog. I am happy to submit it fully to the Kantara DG-BSC efforts if the community is interested.

The use-case is Evidence Notebooks (aka Lab Notebooks, or Patent Notebooks).


John

John Moehrke
Principal Engineering Architect: Standards - Interoperability, Privacy, and Security
CyberPrivacy – Enabling authorized communications while respecting Privacy
M +1 920-564-2067
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https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnmoehrke
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"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?" ("Who watches the watchers?")

On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 7:26 AM, James Hazard <james.g.hazard@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Colin, 

I think it might be helpful to have wider representation of the blockchain community on the thread.  I mention the DG-BSC when I am in conversation with them. 

On deliverables, I think we have spent good time well on discussing what blockchains and smart contracts are and aren't, and could do more on how they fit into a broader picture of automation, institutions, privacy and security.  (Elements of the blockchain community, IMHO, sometimes think they don't need to think about institutions, since ridding the world of institutions is the goal of decentralization.)

I suggest that we could:

Describe a general "smart contract" paradigm on the lines of:

i)   events - (Barclay's and R3's "parameters")
ii)  text objects ("prose," actors, things, places, etc.)
iii) Smart Contract Description Language
iv) code

We could describe the relationship between this "smart contract" record of relationships and transactions, on the one hand, and various databases on the other.  

We could describe some uses cases where blockchain databases were useful.

This would not exclude developing use-case verticals.  The consent to use of genetic information use case seems potent.







On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 4:57 AM, Colin Wallis <colin_wallis@hotmail.com> wrote:

Thanks All

Interesting thoughts and discussion.

Indeed we could invite some other folks not engaged here to add their use cases.

But it would need to be pretty soon.

We are more than half way through the 6 month period for collecting use cases, allowing some time for the report to be written up with recommendations on what work we might take forward to a WG to deliver a specific useful tangible output.

There is plenty of talk in this domain. But Kantara value proposition that it is about 'doing', and the community will be the better for a useful deliverable as a result. Let's not divert from that goal. 

That said, there is nothing to stop another DG, or a re-charter of this DG, working on a another suite of use cases perhaps for a particular context.

Cheers

Colin




From: dg-bsc-bounces@kantarainitiative.org <dg-bsc-bounces@kantarainitiative.org> on behalf of Patrick Curry <patrick.curry@bbfa.info>
Sent: 28 August 2016 22:15
To: James Hazard
Cc: dg-bsc@kantarainitiative.org
Subject: Re: [DG-BSC] FYI
 
The devil is in the detail and also in the minds of innovators and start ups.

Back end transactions of smart contracts differ from the smart contracts in BCs with their transparency property.  My colleagues see a difference and it is giving rise to new user cases.  One involves the ability of all parties in a police incident to be able to validate that the legally permitted individual policeman is assigned to a specific task for that incident in real time based on his skills, training, authority etc.  The rules are being executed in a distributed fashion with distributed inputs, all assured.  This particular example is in the concept stage.  However, there is another international logistic example. leveraging an existing pilot, that is expected to move into implementation soon.

I’ll speak to Colin.  We could be inviting some of the more forward BC companies to engage in the KI discussion.

regards,

Patrick

Patrick Curry
Director

British Business Federation Authority - BBFA Ltd
M: +44 786 024 9074
T:   +44 1980 620606
patrick.curry@bbfa.info
www.bbfa.info – a not-for-profit, self-regulating body   



On 28 Aug 2016, at 20:07, James Hazard <james.g.hazard@gmail.com> wrote:

Yes, IPFS is a very useful resource.

The chain of consent to use of information seems to unify many use cases.  A few links in the chain from prior threads in the discussion:

Patient consent from our discussion earlier this week:

Data transfer agreements on the EU "Model Clauses":
(Available in 20+ languages, about six of which are in the demo).




On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 10:36 AM, Thomas Hardjono <hardjono@mit.edu> wrote:

Jim,

With regards to legal contracts for data-sharing, this could be (should be) a good use-case for BSC.

/thomas/



________________________________________
From: Jim Willeke [jim@willeke.com]
Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2016 9:56 AM
To: John Wunderlich
Cc: Thomas Hardjono; dg-bsc@kantarainitiative.org
Subject: Re: [DG-BSC] FYI

I agree with /thomas/. There is no reason smart contracts could not be done via a protocol with the back-end system be unknown.

IPFS could be used as an example.

JLINC<http://www.jlinclabs.com/protocol/> is one such idea.

--
-jim
Jim Willeke

On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 5:24 AM, John Wunderlich <john@wunderlich.ca<mailto:john@wunderlich.ca>> wrote:
Blockchains of adherence?

If smart contracts are published on well known URI’s, then agreeing to them by signing the contract and putting the MAC on the blockchain provides some level of assurance. This becomes even more powerful when the smart contract can accept or negotiate terms and what gets recorded on the blockchain memorialized the terms freely negotiated by both parties bots.

???


Sincerely,
John Wunderlich
@PrivacyCDN

Call: +1 (647) 669-4749<tel:%2B1%20%28647%29%20669-4749>
eMail: john@wunderlich.ca<mailto:john@wunderlich.ca>

On 28 August 2016 at 08:20, Thomas Hardjono <hardjono@mit.edu<mailto:hardjono@mit.edu>> wrote:

Thanks John,

Good piece.

I think there is still a lot of confusion about the promise of smart-contracts executing collectively on a syntax-rich set of nodes, vs the very limited Bitcoin-blockchain of today.

Maybe BSC-DG could come up with our own new terms or language to describe the possible features of smart contracts.


/thomas/

___________________________________

On Aug 27, 2016, at 11:48 PM, John Wunderlich <john@wunderlich.ca<mailto:john@wunderlich.ca>> wrote:

https://theconversation.com/blockchain-really-only-does-one-thing-well-62668



Thanks, John
4giv spellin errurz from mobile devize



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