October 2022 - WG-UMA - mailman.kantarainitiative.org

Draft minutes from UMA telecon 2022-10-27
by Alec Laws 28 Oct '22

28 Oct '22

https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/97353729/UMA+telecon+20… UMA telecon 2022-10-27Date and Time - Primary-week Thursdays 06:30am PT; Secondary-week Thursdays 10:00am PT - Screenshare and dial-in: https://zoom.us/j/99487814311?pwd=dTAvZi9uN0ZmeXJReWRrc1Zycm5KZz09 - United States: +1 346 248 7799, Access Code: 994 8781 4311 - See UMA calendar for additional details: https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518/Calendar <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518> Agenda - Approve minutes since UMA telecon 2022-06-30 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/14352423> - FAPI and UMA next steps. OAuth compatible UMA version - AOB Attendees - NOTE: As of October 26, 2020, quorum <http://kantarainitiative.org/confluence/display/uma/Participant+Roster> is 5 of 8. (Michael, Domenico, Peter, Sal, Thomas, Alec, Eve, Steve) - Voting: - Alec - Sal - Non-voting participants: - Chris - Regrets: - Steve Quorum: No Meeting Minutes Approve previous meeting minutes - Approve minutes of UMA telecon 2022-08-11 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/39124993>, UMA telecon 2022-08-25 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/45875201>, UMA telecon 2022-09-08 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/56459265> , UMA telecon 2022-09-15 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/62029825> , UMA telecon 2022-09-22 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/62980097> , UMA telecon 2022-09-29 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/74055681> , UMA telecon 2022-10-06 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/79101953> , UMA telecon 2022-10-13 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/85721089> , UMA telecon 2022-10-20 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/91193345> - Deferred - no quorum Topics FAPI and UMA next steps - OAuth compatible UMA version https://fapi.openid.net/ UMA isn’t just additional to OAuth, but also changes defined functionality: - request/response names (scope / ticket, claims_redirect_uri) → creates need to change oauth libraries or create uma custom tech stacks - well defines AuthZ steps, the multi-step possibilities of ticket/correlation handles makes the flows extremely variable (eg can have 3 token calls, followed by claims gathering). To address those concerns, is it possible to create an intermediary spec that is OAuth compliant? OAuth <> *OAuth compliant UMA* <> Full UMA What’s the minimum viable UMA features set: needs_info, RqP role, claims_pushing, RS first flows What could be removed: PCT, request_submitted, *ticket(!)* Token endpoint, still need a new grant type for claims pushing, maybe renamed from uma-ticket to uma or uma-claims. There is no OAuth grant_type for this today - pro: OAuth BW compatibility - pro: maintain RqP separation, needs_info and claims pushing - con: no multi-step authZ (no ticket as correlation handle) - no pushing claims in multiple steps, no pushing claims + interactive gathering - no need/ less value of PCT - could be addressed by unique transactional scope created by AS? some challenges here.. - possible: remove PCT and request_submitted. Features that are less 'used' even by UMA impls? Reduce scope for reader/implementer - neutral: client can stay ignorant of authZ details since its’ returned the scopes to ask for Pushed Claims Case: 1. client requests resource, gets www-authenticate with scope string 2. client requests token, gets need_info with options (push or gather) and scope string (maybe changed) 3. client requests token with claims, gets RPT (or needs_info again?) 4. client requests resource with RPT Gathering Use Case 1. client requests resource, gets www-authenticate with scope string 2. client requests token, gets need_info with options (push or gather) and scope string (maybe changed) 3. client does authorization code flow with AS (/authorize → /callback) 4. client requests token with code, gets RPT 5. client requests resource with RPT Next steps: - Can we see this side by side with oauth - what are the implications to UMA Fedz - Draft UMA-lite spec text

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Agenda for UMA telecon 2022-10-27
by Alec Laws 26 Oct '22

26 Oct '22

https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/97353729/UMA+telecon+20… UMA telecon 2022-10-27Date and Time - Primary-week Thursdays 06:30am PT; Secondary-week Thursdays 10:00am PT - Screenshare and dial-in: https://zoom.us/j/99487814311?pwd=dTAvZi9uN0ZmeXJReWRrc1Zycm5KZz09 - United States: +1 346 248 7799, Access Code: 994 8781 4311 - See UMA calendar for additional details: https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518/Calendar <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518> Agenda - Approve minutes since UMA telecon 2022-06-30 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/14352423> - FAPI and UMA next steps. OAuth compatible UMA version - AOB

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Draft minutes for UMA telecon 2022-10-20
by Alec Laws 21 Oct '22

21 Oct '22

https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/91193345/UMA+telecon+20… UMA telecon 2022-10-20Date and Time - Primary-week Thursdays 06:30am PT; Secondary-week Thursdays 10:00am PT - Screenshare and dial-in: https://zoom.us/j/99487814311?pwd=dTAvZi9uN0ZmeXJReWRrc1Zycm5KZz09 - United States: +1 346 248 7799, Access Code: 994 8781 4311 - See UMA calendar for additional details: https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518/Calendar <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518> Agenda - Approve minutes since UMA telecon 2022-06-30 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/14352423> - FAPI and UMA next steps - AOB Attendees - NOTE: As of October 26, 2020, quorum <http://kantarainitiative.org/confluence/display/uma/Participant+Roster> is 5 of 8. (Michael, Domenico, Peter, Sal, Thomas, Alec, Eve, Steve) - Voting: - Alec - Non-voting participants: - Hanfei - Regrets: Quorum: No Meeting Minutes Approve previous meeting minutes - Approve minutes of UMA telecon 2022-08-11 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/39124993>, UMA telecon 2022-08-25 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/45875201>, UMA telecon 2022-09-08 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/56459265> , UMA telecon 2022-09-15 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/62029825> , UMA telecon 2022-09-22 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/62980097> , UMA telecon 2022-09-29 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/74055681> , UMA telecon 2022-10-06 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/79101953> , UMA telecon 2022-10-13 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/85721089> - Deferred - no quorum Topics FAPI and UMA next steps https://fapi.openid.net/ Went though UMA Grant and marked up what could be changed to be backwards compatible with OAuth UMA 2.0 Grant for OAuth 2.0 - Alec markup.pdf 20 Oct 2022, 01:38 PM

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Agenda for UMA telecon 2022-10-20
by Alec Laws 20 Oct '22

20 Oct '22

https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/91193345/UMA+telecon+20… UMA telecon 2022-10-20Date and Time - Primary-week Thursdays 06:30am PT; Secondary-week Thursdays 10:00am PT - Screenshare and dial-in: https://zoom.us/j/99487814311?pwd=dTAvZi9uN0ZmeXJReWRrc1Zycm5KZz09 - United States: +1 346 248 7799, Access Code: 994 8781 4311 - See UMA calendar for additional details: https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518/Calendar <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518> Agenda - Approve minutes since UMA telecon 2022-06-30 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/14352423> - FAPI and UMA next steps - AOB

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Agenda for UMA telecon 2022-10-13
by Alec Laws 12 Oct '22

12 Oct '22

https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/85721089/UMA+telecon+20… UMA telecon 2022-10-13Date and Time - Primary-week Thursdays 06:30am PT; Secondary-week Thursdays 10:00am PT - Screenshare and dial-in: https://zoom.us/j/99487814311?pwd=dTAvZi9uN0ZmeXJReWRrc1Zycm5KZz09 - United States: +1 346 248 7799, Access Code: 994 8781 4311 - See UMA calendar for additional details: https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518/Calendar <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518> Agenda - Approve minutes since UMA telecon 2022-06-30 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/14352423> - FAPI and UMA - AOB

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Draft minutes of UMA telecon 2022-10-06
by Alec Laws 06 Oct '22

06 Oct '22

https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/79101953/UMA+telecon+20… UMA telecon 2022-10-06Date and Time - Primary-week Thursdays 06:30am PT; Secondary-week Thursdays 10:00am PT - Screenshare and dial-in: https://zoom.us/j/99487814311?pwd=dTAvZi9uN0ZmeXJReWRrc1Zycm5KZz09 - United States: +1 346 248 7799, Access Code: 994 8781 4311 - See UMA calendar for additional details: https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518/Calendar <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518> Agenda - Approve minutes since UMA telecon 2022-06-30 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/14352423> - Core UMA content/report (no use-case) - FAPI Part 2 Review and Discussion - Policy Descriptions - AOB Attendees - NOTE: As of October 26, 2020, quorum <http://kantarainitiative.org/confluence/display/uma/Participant+Roster> is 5 of 8. (Michael, Domenico, Peter, Sal, Thomas, Alec, Eve, Steve) - Voting: - Peter - Alec - Steve - Eve - Non-voting participants: - Nancy - Regrets: Quorum: No Meeting Minutes Approve previous meeting minutes - Approve minutes of UMA telecon 2022-08-11 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/39124993>, UMA telecon 2022-08-25 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/45875201>, UMA telecon 2022-09-08 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/56459265> , UMA telecon 2022-09-15 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/62029825> , UMA telecon 2022-09-22 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/62980097> , UMA telecon 2022-09-29 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/74055681> - Deferred - no quorum TopicsCore UMA content (no use-case) we have two tracks here: - uma in health - simpler uma introduction FAPI 1.0: Part 2 Review and Discussion https://fapi.openid.net/ Based on the review, if an UMA AS can support OAuth/OIDC, there’s no reason that FAPI security measures can’t also be achieved. Therefore an UMA AS can support FAPI Can UMA protect a userinfo endpoint? Yes Can UMA be an OIDC server *at the same time*? e.g. accept an openid scope and issue an IDToken - UMA re-naming some OAuth concepts is challenging, redirect_uri and code. - Can we even closer align to OAuth? what would be lost in UMA functionality? multi-step authorization flows, - 1) UMA-lite with goal of backwards compatibility with OAuth 2) Extension of UMA-lite to add back the full suite of UMA features to add pct, tickets, request_submitted Part 2: Advanced Final: Financial-grade API Security Profile 1.0 - Part 2: Advanced <https://openid.net/specs/openid-financial-api-part-2-1_0.html> UMA AS should be able to support the requirements of 5.2.2. Authorization server PKCE: 302 Location /authorize?client_id&state&redirect_uri&code_challenge PAR: POST /par { client_id&state&redirect_uri } → request_handle 302 Location /authorize?request=request_handle&code_challenge JARM: 302 /authorize?request_object=JWT{client_id&state&code_challenge&redirect_uri} Policy Descriptions Computable Consent AOB DirectTrust is working on a lot on similar topics, computable consent, udap vs uma. Alec is going to connect more with them to see if there’s liason activities. - UMA AS is very similar to an Federated Identity Gateway, very similar role&responsibilities - They have a computable consent workgroup, similar topics as ANCR or policy manager - Look back to the UMA + UDAP (not versus) content - goals together - will look to create some mapping between DirectTrust and Kantara WGs, then find the appropriate meetings to bring UMA to that audience - terminology alignment - hey look UMA has already considered the Leadership Elections planned for end of year

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Agenda for UMA telecon 2022-10-06
by Alec Laws 05 Oct '22

05 Oct '22

https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/79101953/UMA+telecon+20… UMA telecon 2022-10-06Date and Time - Primary-week Thursdays 06:30am PT; Secondary-week Thursdays 10:00am PT - Screenshare and dial-in: https://zoom.us/j/99487814311?pwd=dTAvZi9uN0ZmeXJReWRrc1Zycm5KZz09 - United States: +1 346 248 7799, Access Code: 994 8781 4311 - See UMA calendar for additional details: https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518/Calendar <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518> Agenda - Approve minutes since UMA telecon 2022-06-30 <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/14352423> - Core UMA content/report (no use-case) - FAPI Part 2 Review and Discussion - Policy Descriptions - AOB

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Draft minutes of UMA telecon 2022-09-29
by Alec Laws 01 Oct '22

01 Oct '22

> > > https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/74055681/UMA+telecon+20… > > UMA telecon 2022-09-29Date and Time > > - > > Primary-week Thursdays 06:30am PT; Secondary-week Thursdays 10:00am PT > - > > Screenshare and dial-in: > https://zoom.us/j/99487814311?pwd=dTAvZi9uN0ZmeXJReWRrc1Zycm5KZz09 > - > > United States: +1 346 248 7799, Access Code: 994 8781 4311 > - > > See UMA calendar for additional details: > https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518/Calendar > <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/4857518> > > Agenda > > - > > Approve minutes since UMA telecon 2022-06-30 > <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/14352423> > - > > Core UMA content/report (no use-case) > - > > FAPI Part 1 Review and Discussion > - > > Policy Descriptions > - > > AOB > > Attendees > > - > > NOTE: As of October 26, 2020, quorum > <http://kantarainitiative.org/confluence/display/uma/Participant+Roster> is > 5 of 8. (Michael, Domenico, Peter, Sal, Thomas, Alec, Eve, Steve) > - > > Voting: > - > > Alec > - > > Steve > - > > Sal > - > > Non-voting participants: > - > > Scott > - > > Chris > - > > Hanfei > - > > Regrets: > > Quorum: No > > > > Meeting Minutes > > Approve previous meeting minutes > > - > > Approve minutes of UMA telecon 2022-08-11 > <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/39124993>, UMA > telecon 2022-08-25 > <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/45875201>, UMA > telecon 2022-09-08 > <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/56459265> , UMA > telecon 2022-09-15 > <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/62029825> , UMA > telecon 2022-09-22 > <https://kantara.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/uma/pages/62980097> > - > > Deferred - no quorum > > TopicsCore UMA content (no use-case) > > Continue discussion ‘UMA by example’ content > > > > audience: NOT technical, business people - what value does uma provide a > data custodian, users(?) - what value does uma provide the resource owner > > - > > problem that UMA addresses, user-mediate fine-grained authorization. > person not present during access > - > > physical access example(s), car or documents or airbnb(access to a > physical space, RS) vs the specific thing (resource) > - > > shift to access to digital resources/documents, > - > > distributed nature of information: some at home, some with bank > (safe deposit box), some with HCP, > - > > controlling organization, who enforces access > - > > GAP today: broadness of access, synchronous RO-only access, controlled > by single org at a time > - > > UMA applied to example > > > > physical access vs digital access vs uma against use-case: car, documents, > building access > > > > General intro to Authorization: through example, lending > > base example, lending car or documents? → broad authZ open garage > everything is there. In uma, only the car is there > > > > home example, loaning car in the garage > > condo example, valet key > > digital example: car manufacturer managed sharing, > > uma example: user managed sharing > > > > car, access to the garage, key to the car → broad since can access > anything in the garage, key to glovebox. “Allowed to drive between 12-3, > not more than 20mi” > > condo concierge: RO not present, with someone enforcing my wishes > > > > → shift to digital > > > FAPI Part 1 Review and Discussion > > https://fapi.openid.net/ > > Part 1: Baseline > https://openid.net/specs/openid-financial-api-part-1-1_0.html > > > > *5.2.2. Authorization server* > > 15. shall return the list of granted scopes with the issued access token > if the request was passed in the front channel and was not integrity > protected; > > - > > which request, token request? scopes in token response? when would > there not be 'integrity protected'? there would always be TLS/client authn? > is this for public clients? > > 17. should clearly identify the details of the grant to the user during > authorization as in 16.18 of OIDC > <https://openid.net/specs/openid-connect-core-1_0.html>; > > - > > for pushed claims, would the Client have this responsibility? or would > pushed claims need to be ‘off’ in FAPI > > *NOTE*: The requirement to return the list of granted scopes allows > clients to detect when the authorization request was modified to include > different scopes. Servers must still return the granted scopes if they are > different from those requested. > > - > > always return scopes or only under conditions of #15? > > > > Could an UMA Auth Server support OIDC and the openid scope? tentative yes > > - > > there are naming differences eg redirect_uri vs claims_redirect_uri, > code vs ticket > > > > Overall, and UMA AS should be able to support FAPI basiline profile (part > 1) >

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